SARMs: A Potential Way To Build More Muscle

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Performance-enhancing drugs are a touchy subject (just ask Lance Armstrong). Many people consider them cheating, and the most infamous varieties can be seriously dangerous – steroids come to mind.

The last ten years have given rise to an exciting new class of performance-enhancing drug. It’s a collection of compounds called selective androgen receptor modulators (SARMs). The limited research on SARMs looks promising so far. They appear to build muscle and burn fat at a level comparable to steroids, but without the ball-shrinking, liver-destroying, unsightly body hair-growing effects. They act on your hormones, but in a very targeted way, and they show potential if you want to rapidly build muscle and shed fat. 

That said, many SARMs studies are in rats, and there haven’t been any long-term human experiments looking at the safety of SARMs. There could be side effects we don’t know about yet. Playing with your hormones is risky. At the very least, though, SARMs are interesting compounds that merit discussion.

SARMs fall firmly into the realm of experimental biohacking. These are riskier than most of the hacks I talk about. This article presents both the good and bad sides of SARMs. I hope it helps you make an informed decision about whether or not to try them.

Disclaimer: SARMs are on the World Anti-Doping Agency’s list of banned substances for athletic competition. If you’re a competitive athlete, you shouldn’t take these. If you’re a curious self-experimenter looking to upgrade your physical performance, though, SARMs may be worth considering. 

 

How SARMs work (and why they may be better than steroids)

Using steroids to boost your hormones is like trying to tweak a microchip with a sledgehammer. Steroids help you build muscle by increasing testosterone, which then increases protein synthesis in your cells, building muscle and burning fat. That’s considered the anabolic side of steroids, and it’s great.

But steroids also interact with your liver, your prostate, your heart, your sex organs (which leads to ball shrinkage in men and clitoral enlargement in women), and your secondary sex characteristics (voice depth, body hair growth, man boobs, acne, etc.). All these side effects are the androgenic part of steroids.

The issue with steroids is that they have an anabolic-to-androgenic ratio of 1:1. That means they are just as likely to, say, shrink your balls or enlarge your clitoris as they are to build muscle – unless you’re taking bioidentical testosterone to maintain optimal hormone levels, with a doctor’s careful supervision (I’ve been doing this for years and I’ve never had side effects. You can read about hacking testosterone here). 

This is where SARMs innovate. They’re far more selective than steroids, boasting anabolic-to-androgenic ratios starting at 3:1 and going as high as 90:1. That means you can still get muscle growth and fat loss, but SARMs won’t give you man boobs or turn you into the bearded lady. You can also take SARMs orally. No need for injections.

SARMs are also legal, as long as you buy them “for research purposes only.” You’ll notice SARMs retailers include disclaimers like “for lab research purposes only” and “not for human consumption.” They do this in case laws change, so they don’t get in trouble with the government.

There are about a dozen SARMs in either clinical (human) trials or pre-clinical (animal) trials. This article will cover pros and cons of the most popular ones. Again, this is a little more out there than most of the biohacking I discuss. Proceed at your own risk.

With that in mind, let’s talk about the first SARM on the list: MK-2866.

 

MK-2866 builds muscle and burns fat

With multiple published human trials under its belt, MK-2866 (also called ostarine) is one of the best-studied SARMs. Those studies found powerful results, too. Ostarine shows no meaningful side effects and is very effective at building muscle. 

Elderly men and women who took modest doses of ostarine for 12 weeks grew 3 pounds of muscle and lost a pound of fat, with no changes to diet or exercise [1]. Cancer patients saw nearly identical results along a similar timeframe [2]. There were no side effects in either study.

A pound of muscle a month is about what you can expect with a solid workout routine – but the people taking ostarine in these studies weren’t exercising. Combining the two would be even more powerful, in theory. Pretty impressive.

 

Side effects of MK-2866

The studies found no side effects. Anecdotally, however, people report short-term testosterone suppression when they take high doses of ostarine for 8-12 weeks. Testosterone rebounded to normal levels within a couple weeks after they stop. The dosage I discuss below is far lower and for a shorter amount of time, but there’s still a risk of short-term T suppression, and possibly other side effects researchers don’t know about yet.

 

How to dose MK-2866

There haven’t been official dose recommendations for SARMs because they’re so new. The doses in this article are all conservative, and based what on studies and anecdotal reports show to work. 

For ostarine, online communities report results at 15-20mg daily for 4 weeks. Time of day doesn’t matter. To be cautious, take at least 4 weeks off so your system balances out before starting another cycle. Ostarine, along with the other SARMs on this list, seems to pair best with regular exercise like lifting and HIIT.

You can get MK-2866 here (and no, I don’t have a financial relationship with any of the sources linked in this article). 

 

LGD-4033

LGD-4033, also called Ligandrol or Anabolicum, is one of the better studied SARMs. It’s been through multiple human trials, with interesting results:

  • Healthy men who took LGD-4033 for 21 days saw a significant increase in lean body mass. The only side effect was short-term testosterone suppression (more on that in a second) [3]. One milligram per day was enough to cause significant muscle growth. The higher the dose, the more muscle participants put on.
  • In another trial, participants took doses as high as 22 mg/day with no side effects or safety issues [3].
  • In rats, LGD-4033 increases bone density, muscle mass, and sex drive, without damaging prostate or liver tissue [3].

LGD-4033 does not appear to stimulate fat loss, so if you take it on its own, it won’t make you leaner – just more muscular.

 

Side effects of LGD-4033

LGD-4033 will probably suppress your natural testosterone production a bit while you’re on it, although the effects seem to be short-lived [3]. Study participants saw T suppression dependent on dose, but none of them dropped out of the healthy testosterone range, and levels returned to normal within 3 weeks after they stopped taking LGD-4033.

That said, you may want to skip this one (and SARMs in general) if your testosterone is low. Consider biohacking your testosterone instead.

 

How to dose LGD-4033

Users report success taking 2-5 mg of LGD-4033, in a single daily dose, for 4 weeks. It seems that the higher the dose, the more muscle you put on, and the more your testosterone dips. Some people take up to 15 mg per day for much longer timeframes, but that’s riskier. You don’t want your natural T production to tank entirely. Once your 4 weeks are up, wait at least a month before starting another cycle. Here’s a good source.

 

GW501516 

GW501516 (Cardarine) doesn’t have any published human studies. In rodents, though, it shows great promise as an exercise mimetic – it lights up many of the same genes you’d activate by going on a run or lifting [4]. That alone wasn’t enough to make much of a change, but when researchers had mice take GW501516 with consistent exercise, results went through the roof:

  • In mice, GW501516 combined with 4 weeks of regular running increased running time by 68% and running distance by 70%, and doubled overall muscular endurance [4].
  • In rodents, GW501516 plus exercise increased mitochondrial growth in muscle by ~50% [5], allowing muscles to generate more power without fatiguing.
  • It also decreased fat while preserving muscle (again, in mice) [4].

GW501516 could be a powerful way to improve performance and shed fat while maintaining muscle. Hopefully human studies will come out soon.

 

Side effects of GW501516

Shortly after it was classified as a performance-enhancing drug, reports started coming out saying that GW501516 caused cancer in lab rats.

But as with most substances, the devil’s in the dose. Studies did find that GW501516 is carcinogenic…but the rats were taking the human equivalent of 2400 mg a day for 2 years straight [6].

That’s about 240x a normal dose, taken every day, for 104 weeks instead of 4 weeks.

The studies found no evidence that GW501516 causes cancer at a dose you would actually use, or even at doses considerably higher than that. Other rat studies report no side effects, and people in the online SARMs community report none either, including no testosterone suppression. Again, though, that doesn’t mean there aren’t side effects. We may just not know about them. Proceed with caution.

 

How to dose GW501516

GW501516 works best if you split it into two daily doses. Try 5 mg, morning and afternoon, for a total of 10 mg a day.

Take GW501516 for 4 weeks, then cycle off for at least 4 weeks before starting another round. It pairs well with LGD-4033 and MK-2866. Here’s a good source.

 

S4

S4 (andarine) was the earliest SARM. It was popular in the 2008 Olympics, before SARMs were banned from professional athletics. Users report modest strength and muscle gain, as well as modest fat loss.

S4 seems to work best if you use it alongside other SARMs. It pairs well with MK-2866 and LGD-4033. Both suppress testosterone at higher doses, a side effect S4 can counter. But S4 carries unique side effects that may make it better to skip.

 

Side effects of S4

The big side effect with S4 is visual abnormality. There have been no official studies on it, but a lot of users report altered color perception and nighttime blindness (trouble seeing in the dark) after taking S4 for a couple weeks, because one of S4’s metabolites binds to receptors in your eyes. When you also consider that S4 is relatively weak, it begins to look less attractive than other SARMs on this list.

 

How to dose S4

If you do decide to take S4, go for 50 mg daily, split into two 25 mg doses. As with all the other SARMs on this list, take it daily for 4 weeks, and then wait at least 4 weeks before starting another cycle. You can get S4 here.

 

SR9009 for endurance and fat loss…if you inject it

SR9009 (Stenabolic), praised as “exercise in a pill,” seems like the perfect supplement. In mice, it increases endurance and fat burning, decreases inflammation, and stimulates the growth of new mitochondria in muscle cells [7,8]. Obese rats injected with SR9009 lost 60% more weight than rats injected with placebo, without changing diet or exercise.

Assuming SR9009 works in humans too, that sounds great. But the key part of the study is that rats were injected. Taking SR9009 orally is pretty much useless. It has about 2% oral bioavailability, and your system clears that 2% almost immediately [9]. Which is too bad, because most SARM manufacturers sell SR9009 as an oral supplement that’s not suitable for injection. They claim it works; studies show it doesn’t.

You’re better off spending your money on another member of this list, unless you find injection-grade SR9009 and are willing to stick yourself a couple times a day.

 

Final thoughts

Biohacking is about self-experimentation, and it often carries a bit of risk with it – especially if you’re trying cutting-edge things.

Because they’re so new, SARMs carry more risk than most of the stuff I talk about on this blog. This is a little more out there than eating the Bulletproof Diet or hacking your sleep. Proceed at your own risk, use your judgment, and listen to your body.

Have you tried SARMs? Are you going to start? If so, it’d be great if you shared the good and bad in the comments below. Thanks for reading and happy biohacking.

 

Click to read the complete list of references.

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By Dave Asprey

  • Everett K. McDonough

    I wish you would have included the same break down for mk-677. I think this GH inducer is just as interesting and promising.

  • Claude Chandler

    the sight for mk-2866 specifically says not for human consumption. A little paranoid now

    • Claude Chandler

      “site”.

      • John

        They do this to avoid legal issues.

  • Suggestions for reliable sources?

    • Shayan Abbas

      personally I think prohormones are better, and less dangerous.

    • Hey Matt,

      Links are in the article. I don’t have financial relationships with any of the companies; they’re just reputable sources.

      • Thanks Dave. Scanned right over the links ?

        • jeanna.gomes

          After 5 yrs I decided to abandon my last job and I never felt better in my life… I started freelancing on-line, for a company I discovered online, for several hrs every day, and I profit now much more than i did on my previous work… My check for last month was for Nine thousand dollars… The best thing about it is the more free time i got for my kids… KORTA.NU/MDe

      • Sebastian Askevold

        Hi Dave? Know of any safe EU sites that sells SARMs?

  • John

    So, I’ve tried several of these compounds and they all work. Ostarine is amazing for retaining muscle on a low calorie diet and adding a little along the way. Mk-677 really does increase your growth hormone. I can literally feel it working, AKA tingles in my extremities. Now LGD is one that I’ve recently tried and it works, but my testosterone must be just fine because it makes me feel angry/aggressive. However, I’m a young man so this makes complete sense but I would think that older individuals would benefit greatly from it. Overall, ostarine is my number one. I’ve gotten in amazing shape by using it while dieting. Very surprised and happy that Dave posted this because these compounds absolutely work with very, very few side effects, if any.

    • lynda_holmes

      Start making 90 bucks a day for working over the internet from comfort of your own home for couple of h everyday… Get regular payment once a week… Everything you need is a laptop, connection to the internet, as well as some free time… KORTA.NU/MDe

    • John Pabst

      Hey John

      Did you purchase Ostarine from the link Dave provided. If so was one bottle sufficient for a cycle? Did you experience fat loss as well?

      Thanks

      John P.

      • John

        I bought mine from a local supplement store where I live. However, I’d purchase them from the links Dave provided. The general consensus is that sellers of liquid SARMs tend to be more legitimate than those who sell capsuled SARMs. However, I know the guy who sells them locally and he tries his own products, so I trust them and they’ve all worked as advertised. When I use ostarine I like to use intermittent fasting for faster results. It won’t cause fat loss directly, but it will allow you to retain all of your muscle without fear of breakdown. For fat loss, cardarine is the SARM you’d want to look at.

        • peterson.lilia@mail.ru

          Get paid $90 /day for working online from your home office for several hrs a day… Get regular payment every week… Everything you need is a laptop or computer, internet access, plus some spare-time… OW.LY/n1nP303oO1A

        • barbour.stephanie

          One year have passed since I decided to resign from my last work and it was a best decision i made in my life… I started doing work at home, for a company I stumbled upon on-line, several hours each day, and I make much more than i did on my office work… Payment i got for last month was for $9k… Superb thing about this job is that i have more free time for my family… CHILP.IT/8d93f4b

        • delora.flickinger.92

          1 year have passed since I decided to resign from my old work and it changed my life… I started working from home, for a company I stumbled upon on-line, few hrs every day, and I earn much more than i did on my old job… Last paycheck i got was for $9k… Awesome thing about it is that i have more free time for my loved ones… SECURE54.COM

        • hesterbeaton

          After 5 yrs I finally left my previous job and that decision was a life changer for me… I started doing a job online, over a website I stumbled upon online, few hrs /a day, and I profit now much more than i did on my last work… My check for last month was for 9k… Amazing thing about it is that now i have more time for my kids… CHILP.IT/8d93f4b

        • mary.white

          After 5 years I decided to resign from my old job and I am so happy now… I started working from home, for a company I stumbled upon over internet, few hrs every day, and I make much more than i did on my previous job… My payment for last month was for 9 thousand bucks… The best thing about this job is the more time i got for my kids… CHILP.IT/8d93f4b

        • shirley.vong

          After 5 yrs I decided to abandon my office job and I never felt this good… I started to work online, for this company I discovered on-line, few hrs every day, and I profit now much more than i did on my old work… My last month payment was for $9000… The best thing about it is that i have more free time for my loved ones… CHILP.IT/728813e

        • kim_rowley

          1 year ago I decided to resign from my last job and I am so happy now… I started to work from comfort of my house, for a company I discovered on-line, several hours each day, and I profit now much more than i did on my office work… My last month check was for $9k… Amazing thing about it is the more free time i got for my loved ones… SECURE38.COM

    • Aman

      John,
      How long did you take Ostarine? If longer than 4 weeks, did you take anything for a PCT afterwards?

      • dstorey

        One yr have passed since I decided to abandon my previous job and I never felt this good… I started to work on-line, over a site I found online, few hrs daily, and my income now is much bigger then it was on my previous work… My last month paycheck was for $9k… Amazing thing about this gig is the more free time i got for my family… KORTA.NU/MDe

      • virginia.morgan

        After 5 years I left my old job and I am so happy now… I started working over internet, for this company I found over internet, several hrs /a day, and I make much more than i did on my last work… My last month check was for Nine thousand bucks… Amazing thing about this is that now i have more time for my kids… KORTA.NU/MDe

      • jordan_doris

        It’s been 1 year since I finally abandoned my old job and that decision was a life changer for me… I started freelancing from comfort of my home, for this company I found online, few hrs a day, and I profit now much more than i did on my office work… Payment i got for last month was for $9000… Amazing thing about this is that i have more free time for my family… KORTA.NU/MDe

      • jasmine.latimer

        It’s been 1 yr since I decided to leave my old work and it was a best decision i made in my life… I started freelancing over internet, for this company I stumbled upon online, for several hrs every day, and I earn much more than i did on my last work… Payment i got for last month was for 9k dollars… Amazing thing about this job is that i have more time for my kids… KORTA.NU/MDe

      • John

        I used it for two 4 weeks sessions. Both went great with no side effects. I’m using it again, but for 8 weeks this time. Side effects are said to be more probable after the 4 week mark, so I’ll be watching out for those.

        • juliecook.92

          One yr have passed since I decided to abandon my old job and that decision changed everything for me… I started to work online, over a site I found on-line, several hours /a day, and my income now is much bigger then it was on my old work… Last check i got was for 9 thousand dollars… The best thing about it is the more free time i got with my kids… CHILP.IT/8d93f4b

        • constance.lemon

          After 5 years I abandoned my office work and I am so happy now… I started doing work online, for this company I stumbled upon over internet, several hrs every day, and I earn much more than i did on my previous work… My payment for last month was for 9k dollars… The best thing about this work is the more free time i got for my loved ones… CHILP.IT/8d93f4b

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  • aed939

    All of these compounds, except SR9009, contain fluoride (F), which destroys tendons and ligaments. Don’t touch anything with an “F” in it unless it is life or death.

  • Andrew Stephen Pratt

    I’ve read the Ostarine is supposed be pretty cost effective…. but the dosages recommended here compared to the cost per mg from the linked site add up to a pretty penny… Dave recommends 15-20mg/day for a month. On the low end that would make a one month supply 450 mgs. The bottle for sale on the linked site is 33mgs for $55.99. i.e. $1.70/mg or $763.50 for just a one month supply (assuming the lower end of recommended dosage at 15mg/day). Am I missing something here? Dave?

  • Thanks for addressing SARMS. I asked a question about these a while back, so I’m glad you circled around to talk about this method of fat loss and muscle gain. I am experimenting with LGD-4033 and will write a nice long post on my experience after 3 months of cycling the LGD. I do have a concern with the flourine in the product. Most chemicals containing F are associated with toxicity and bioaccumulation, so I am very wary of long term use of the flourine containing supplements. Do your research.

  • Would it be particularly unwise for younger people to play with these?

    • Nori Webb

      I’d like to hear an opinion on this as well. I’m 21 and looking to improve my athletic performance.

  • Interesting read. The older I get, though, the more I just want to be healthy and energetic. In my twenties I had insecurities surrounding body composition that lead me to try various supplements. All were bought legally at chain stores but I am regretful of some of the things I tried, especially for the sake of mainly masking insecurities. One product in particular caused some significant changes and swings in my hormonal balance. I am leery of ever risking a healthy median level of hormones again. That is just my personal experience though. I am completely open minded and supportive of anyone making an informed decision to try and improve an area of their life using supplements.

  • John nailed it. It’s so the companies don’t have to set aside an extra $50 million or so to navigate the regulations around selling research chemicals to humans.

    What you do with research chemicals in your own home is your business, as long as you aren’t a competitive athlete 😉

    • judy.anderson

      One year ago I decided to abandon my old job and I never felt this good… I started working from my house, over a site I discovered on-line, several hours every day, and I make much more than i did on my previous work… Last check i got was for $9000… Awesome thing about this is that now i have more time for my loved ones… KORTA.NU/MDe

  • c-brook

    This was an interesting post and good thread.

    Dave: what’a your view on SARMs and their suppression of HDL? Seems like that would be one consideration worth noting. Has your HDL been negatively impacted as a result of your usage?

  • Nori Webb

    Hi! Really informative and interesting article, but I’m curious about the fluoride in the MK-2866 and the GW 501516. I’d love to give these products a try, but not at the expense of toxicity and damage to my ligaments and tendons. Could you expound a little on this, please! Thanks!

  • Nori Webb

    Another question, and this may seem very simple and silly to anyone with any knowledge about these products, but say you take one or any of these SARMs and you gain muscle, lose fat, etc. But you decide to cycle off of them for whatever reason. Will you lose the muscle gains and regain the fat?

  • Troy Thomas

    I am considering a cycle of MK-2866. The dosing appears to be 15-20 mg per day ( totalling 600 mg for the month) and the cost of each bottle in the link provided is in the mid $50.00 range. Does anyone know the approximate costs of 30 day dosing of MK-2866?

  • Bill Williams

    Dave, Thank you for restoring this link. I am 1 week into my first SARM Experiment
    I am testing the following from the Peptides Warehouse:
    LGD-4033 10mg per ml x 30ml
    GW-501516 10mg per ml x 30ml
    MK-2866 33mg per ml x 30ml
    I am testing with 1ml of each first thing in the morning on an empty stomach down back of thought.
    Day 1 I performed my normal routine: Rows, Bench Press, Shoulder press, Pull Downs, Squats On day 2 I noticed that my recovery time had dramatically improved. I am a 49YOM and typically lift 1 day per week. I typically need the week to recover, rebuild and see new strength gains. Day 3 I implemented a new routine: Bench Press, Shoulder Press. I saw mild strength gains in each. Day 4 Rows, Pulldowns, Squats and saw mild gains in each. Day 5 Bench Press, Shoulder Press saw additional gains Day 6 Rows, Pulldowns, Squats and saw additional gains. Day 7 took the day off though I feel as if I have recovered enough to see new strength gains again. I have not been able to recover and seen rapid gains like this since I was playing football in college 30 years ago.
    I currently plan to continue this experiment for a second week and then I will take 2 weeks off – Mostly because I will be traveling and will not be able to keep a consistent routine.

    • allankiezel

      @disqus_18zH3WCV0l:disqus do you take the dropper orally or do you mix it with something? I just purchased the MK-2866 and I’m note sure how to take it. 🙂 Thanks!

      • Nan St Yves

        Did you get a reply yet? I’m wondering the same thing.

      • Bill Williams

        I use a long thin plastic syringe instead of a dropper to ensure an acurate dose. I squirte it down the back of my throat. I do not mix it with anything.

  • Fiona Shearer-Hann

    So, after reading this article I decided to try a couple… got them today (in the most random packaging ever) so I’m going to see what transpires over the next month (trying MK-2866 first).

    • Etone

      How’s it going with your trial?

  • AirFed

    You mention dosing but how is it administered? I see a ‘dropper’ in the bottles on the Peptide Warehouse site. How many drops is 5mg or 10 mg? Do you leave it under the tongue? I don’t care to inject it. I’m may try this for a cycle or two and check the results.

    • Nan St Yves

      Did you get a reply? I was wondering the same thing.

      • AirFed

        Marcio Carvalho 2 months ago

        I called them and they said one drop equals to 1ml. On MK2866 1 ml equals 30mg

    • Marcio Carvalho

      I called them and they said one drop equals to 1ml. On MK2866 1 ml equals 30mg

  • Sebastian Askevold

    Hi again. Just wondering why my previous post was deleted?

  • Bill Williams

    I am back from 6 days of flights and multiple time zones and 3 days into my second 14 day SARM experiment. As an update to my previous post on my 13th day I significantly broke through a shoulder press plateau.
    I had one unusual experience on day 1 of the start of my 2nd 14 days. The only items I had consumed that morning were 1 cup of bullet proof coffee and in the afternoon airplane black coffee and half of a 90% Lindt Dark Chocolate Bar. After many hours of flights I returned home and took 1 ml each of LGD-4033, GW-50151, MK-2866. About an hour later I had lightly cooked broccoli with Brain Octane. That evening I noticed stomach inflammation. Not sure if this was an interaction with SARMs and food or something else. Typically I take my SARMS at 7am and other than bullet proof coffee do not have any other food until 2pm. No other issues or inflammation noticed except for day 1.
    After 6 days off SARMS and 7 days away from the Gym; on day 2 and 3 I have been able to maintain my previous strength gains.

    • Leif

      Look up PEG, polyethylene glycol, that $hit is in many of the distributor’s solution as a solvent. It is dangerous. No more sarms for me.. It will wreck havoc on you heart, kidneys, CNS, and other organs. It will cause erosion of you intestinal mucosa over time. I was wondering why I had so much acid reflux and I believe that PEG is at fault. Avoid this crap. Get some roids, hgh or some good supplements. PEG is insidiously damaging. I’m nervous now about the long term effects it may have on my own health at this point..

      • Alek Eichelberger

        you have an allergy to it

  • Rob Power

    I have just started taking Ostarine, day 1 I took 2 x capsules together (20mg) at around1pm, the results: increase in body temp and hot sweats after about 40 minutes of ingesting. That died down and I had a good training session around 5.30pm I could really see and feel the pump in my muscles. Day 2 I had a slight scare, again took 2 x capsules together (20mg) and again could feel the effect kicking in around 40 minutes but this time I felt very strange and could see I was having a reaction, I was producing a heat rash and my hands, face, ears and neck produced a very red heat rash and I also felt like I had a lot of brain fog (this may have been due to an increase in cortisol as I was feeling very stressed due to this reaction.) it eventually died down after an hour and again I had a fairly good training session with a good pump. I figured the problem was either because the half life of a 10mg is 12 hours and so taking two together is 24 hours I’m guessing, and so I think I took the day 2 dosage too soon after the day 1 dosage (I may have been one or two hours too early). Or secondly it could of been that I was already on an anti-histamine tablet and steroid nose spray for my hay fever allergy. So day 3 I took a detox day to eliminate anything out my system. I didn’t take the anti-histamine, nose spray or Ostarine. Day 4 I took a single 10mg dosage at 2pm and didn’t react this time so I have a feeling the anti-histamine tablet made my body react aggressively to the SARM as it was a foreign new substance entering my body. I felt good today and had an exceptional workout and really felt the pumps and could see them. In fact the pump was so big in my arms I could really feel my arms getting tight. Weirdly my right hand now feels a little weaker than usual now I’m back home as I’m typing this. I also took a pre-workout today though that combined of caffeine, yohimbe, hmb, citruline malate and beta alanine so I may feel a little “buzzed” off those substances still. Anyone’s thoughts on this or input would be greatly appreciated I would love to hear about some more info or different experiences?

    • Alek Eichelberger

      you should start with 1 pill that doesnt sound right

  • Marcio Carvalho

    Yes

  • Germe Christopher

    Besides peptide wharehouse… any other reputable sources of Ostarine (Mk-2866)?

  • ronnie420

    I am 45 yrs old, currently taking 160ml testosterone from my doc weekly for low t. Is it safe to take sarms while taking test or should I discontinue for length of the sarms cycle?

    • Leif

      AVOID Sarms that contain PEG…

    • Al Green

      There’s really no reason to take SARMS if you’re already on testosterone. If the technology advances significantly SARMS can be superior to testosterone and its derivatives, but at this point they have a long way to go. Testosterone is still the gold standard.

  • Leif

    Avoid sarms… Most contain PEG, polyethylene glycol, that $hit is in many of the distributor’s solution as a solvent. It is dangerous. No more sarms for me.. It will wreck havoc on you heart, kidneys, CNS, and other organs. It will cause erosion of you intestinal mucosa over time. I was wondering why I had so much acid reflux and I believe that PEG is at fault. Avoid this crap. Get some roids, hgh or some good supplements. PEG is insidiously damaging. I’m nervous now about the long term effects it may have on my own health at this point..

    • vasras

      Thank you for the warning, Leif!
      Can you tell me if you’ve found _any_ supplier that guarantees (with lab tests) not to have PEG in their SARMS?

      • Leif

        I Guess They Deleted My reply .. Here is a 2nd attempt. Iron-dragon. C o m seems to use a different solvent. They are more expensive than some of the others.

    • Hey Leif,

      Sounds like you may be allergic to PEG.

      From my research, the only study that found that PEG damaged the heart, liver, kidneys, etc. is a single case study of a chronic alcoholic who was receiving intravenous PEG as a vehicle for Valium, 18 hours a day, to help him detox from alcohol. That’s a lot of PEG, and considering he’s an alcoholic, I’d guess his heart, liver, and kidneys weren’t in good shape in the first place.

      PEG probably isn’t great, but you’re getting less than half a mL of it with each dose of SARMs. It’s up to you whether the benefits are worth taking a few drops of PEG.

    • Joseph Matthew

      Leif, you really should do research before you make such broad and largely inaccurate claims. You obviously haven’t taken organic chemistry or chemistry in general…PEG is used in thousands, if not millions of medicines and ingestible products. 99.9% of the population has no issue. Your claim is as ludicrous as if I said, “oh my god everyone must stay away from peanuts and other tree nuts, because I’m allergic to nuts!” I’m not saying to just go all out and start popping SARMs for breakfast, I’m just saying PEG is not what Leif is suggesting and is a compound used widely in production of food and medicine. If you’ve ever been involved in the healthcare industry at any capacity, you would know this.

      • Leif

        Listen here you d****** I have over 20 hours of chemistry which includes organic chemistry, biochemistry and clinical chemistry so don’t tell me just because pharmaceutical companies put it in several medicines that it’s safe. You’re a damn idiot if you believe that. You go ahead and take it along with the cock that you put in your butt every night. It’s not safe and I’m sorry your know-it-all High Supremacy doesn’t believe it. Frankly I don’t give a damn.

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  • Gabe El

    Probably needed to up the dose.

  • Odd Bjerga

    Hi Dave. Very interesting subject! The link you provided for MK-2866 is broken. Any changes to the availability of this product? Or can you recommend other sources?

  • Debbie Belcore

    Can women take it for similar results?

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  • Derek

    I’m on week 3 of the 4033/501516 combo that Dave mentions in a podcast. I have been using the recommended doses in this article. I had pretty high expectations, but have found little to no effect at all. Not sure if I should see the 4 weeks through at the dose I’m using, or up it. How long should one wait before seeing effects?

    • chambers mcclay

      working out or anything just wondering bc I’m taking the top three and its my second day haft had the chance to lift yet but will today

    • Chris Wrigley

      I would change your supplier,you should have noticed benefits/side effects within first few days….Your gear is BUNK!

      • Derek

        I was wondering if there was a supply issue, but as I said, I am using the suppliers linked in this article. Maybe the order system has an algorithm:

        if(customer name == Dave Asprey){
        send real product;
        }else{
        send placebo;
        }

        … but I doubt it.

        It would be nice to know if there are genetic or other variables that makes them less effective on certain people, but I guess that would require more testing data that just isn’t available.
        In looking back at my workout logs, I would say my performance overall is dropping. Either flat or declining on weight/reps over time, and I’m tiring faster. This is compared to the previous 8 weeks of slow but steady improvement on weight/reps/energy. Other things that had previously improved (like arthritis in my hands) on the bulletproof diet seem to be slipping back to the way they were before. May just be a coincidence, don’t like to jump to conclusions.

        I may try MK2866 in a few months to see if it works any better than the LGD4033.

        • Chris Wrigley

          Okay let me give you a run down on what i experience everytime i experiment and see if you can see a similar effect…When i am deep into ketogenic diet my inflammation goes away my arthritis (hands,knees,hips and elbows) all goes almost away,i feel revived,wake early,sleep light etc.Then when i do a weight,muscle gain bulk,my food intake has to rise dramatically ie Carbs must increase,if i don’t go to at least 250gm carbs a day i just cannot maintain my exercise level and gain the muscle i want,keto diet is great for maintainence but no good for bulking and heavy resistance/cardio training,any good sports nutritionist knows this,so after 5-6 weeks my inflammation shoots right back up and i have to quit bulking again for 6 months,with these new sarms i can do long slow bulks on just slightly higher than maintainence calorie intake.So if it’s 8 weeks on and you have plateaued and have started to regress first thing i would look at is have you been increasing your calorie intake incrementally? Are you training too hard? recovery is as if not more important,have you tried changing your routine? a stale training routine may be causing psychological regression we all get fed up of it,you may be prone to androgenic effects ie water retention,LGD is stronger than MK2866 and perhaps you are feeling these effects which could make you tired? i get this when i use Testosterone,if you want to find out definitively you need to stop one of the compounds keep on with the other see how you reactdouble check your food and rest and training,it’s a long slow process of experimentation my friend

        • Derek

          Chris,

          Thanks for all the input. I had upped the dose for this (4th) week, and found the performance loss increased. As of today, I am pulling the plug on the SARMS and will observe what happens over the next few weeks.

          As for workout routine, I have been using the workout plan laid out in “The TNT Diet” by Dr. Jeff Volek/Adam Campbell since 2008. Good success with both the diet and workout plan, even more so since I have made the diet portion “Bulletproof”. The workouts do a good job of keeping things changing, targeting different muscle fibers etc. Best I have found for someone with little time to spend working out. I have “re-started” the plan a few times since ’08 after stopping, usually following the birth of one of my kids (loss of sleep is a killer). Sleep hacking is what led me to discover Bulletproof in the first place.

      • Greg Hawn

        Chris, what blood work markers would you suggest?

  • hokusai

    Any update on the risk of Flourine ?

  • Justin Temore

    How long does a bottle of GW501516 last? How many cycles will I get per bottle and how is it dosed (one drop, two drop, etc.)? I’d like to experiment with the minimum effective dosage. ~Thanks

  • chambers mcclay

    I’m taking the top three all at once. this will be my first week i moved you in weight on lifting a good bit could have gone up more i think but didn’t want to push my self the first week to much. girlfriend also taking the same three and also went up in weight on lifts. we also been running half mile as fast as week can when we are done lifting that has also improved some. she has lose and inch and i think i have put on some weight also so both reaching some goals

    but
    Stomach from time to time feels funny and get a little dizzy and stuff kinda thought the head stuff was the gw501616 with the mitochondria growth and things like that but was just wondering if this is happening to other or something i should or should be doing?

    thanks

    • chambers mcclay

      i got the them all form where he recommend them from except i got the gw501516 from peptidewearhouse and not sarms website only difference but we are taking the right amounts

  • Daniel Romer

    Thanks for the article!

    I haven’t noticed anyone talking about caloric intake or macro nutrient ratios…?

    Some bodyBuilding sites I visited address it from that viewpoint (way more carbs) but I’m in ketosis and not wanting to loose the brain/mental stabilizing effects of that! 🙂

    Anyone experienced effects either way?

    Thanks!

  • Steve Weissman

    Just got GW501516 (Cardarine) from your source listed. Excited to see the results.

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  • Joshua Douglas

    Can someone clear this up for me…
    From the website Dave shared the bottle of MK-2866 is 30ml and 50mg/ml. That means there is 1500mg per bottle? If the recommended dosage is 15-20mg, would that be about 1/3 of a dropper per serving? That means there are 150 servings per bottle? TIA!

    • Steve Weissman

      Correct

  • Steve Weissman

    Which is a better source for GW 501516, SARMS-X or Peptide Warehouse?

  • Greg Hawn

    Hi Dave, what blood tests would you recommend pre/post?

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  • Brian Monroe

    Has anyone utilized a PCT cycle after the initial 4 weeks of SARMS. This article has been very informative, but now seeing a possible need to use a PCT to recover in the 4 weeks off from SARMs before starting round 2. First 4 weeks had great gains in tone and muscle with minimal intensity work outs. (I need to recover some muscle loss in my 40s). In week 5 now and not noticing any drops, but just in case and to reduce body stress, wondering if Milk Thistle or something can help bridge the off time. Just interested in your thoughts BulletProof enthusiasts!